Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Go down

Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Cosimo de Medici on Mon Jul 10, 2017 1:23 pm

So I have noticed a general lack of knowledge around the Eastern front (Germany might have beaten the Russians within a few months) and I wish to be enlightened by people who have actual accurate knowledge of this area, I will firstly list my thoughts about Germany's biggest failiures in the Eastern front.

1:Stalingrad
Stalingrad is most certainly Germany's biggest failiure and most tactically useless offense. The offense of Stalingrad was planned but not well hidden, Germany's notorious panzers had eliminated Russian opposition due to lack of predictability, but the very vivid mobolisation around Stalingrad had alerted the Russians allowing them to prepare a defense. The Panzer's sudden and erratic attacks led to Stalin keeping his reserve units in Moscow and Vatutin's defensive of Voronzeh. Also the German's were fighting a long, battle of attrition, which is very clearly something the Blitzkrieg was not designed for and thus they lost many advantages, they also wasted many men for the capture of one city which probably would have been burned anyway.

2: Diplomatic incompetence
Germany did not even ask for a Japenese offensive in Russia and instead Japan used their resources and manpower in China.

3:Hubris
The head of the German state failed to take any criticism and demoted staff for example the strategic mastermind Fedor von Bock.

4: Weak defensive
The leader of Germany kept his units in Stalingrad even though there were signs of a Russian offensive (Stalingrad was hard to defend). General Blumentritt Chief Quarter Master of OKH told the leader it would not be safe to hold "such a defensive flank furing winter" and Romanian Commander Petre Dumitrescu had predicted a large Russian attack against his troops.

5: Planning
The Germans during planning, did not utilise any propaganda so that the Polish or Ukranians would revolt against their overlords. One plan arguably the best (To charge through Russia like a spear and take Moscow) was denied by the incompetent leader of Germany and he decided somehow that he would advance slowly and strategically which made little sense as they were using the Blitzkrieg.


Last edited by Cosimo de Medici on Mon Jul 10, 2017 1:28 pm; edited 1 time in total

Cosimo de Medici
Pedes

Posts : 3
Join date : 2017-07-10

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Cosimo de Medici on Mon Jul 10, 2017 1:25 pm

Also I forgot the sources :
Stalingrad by Rupert Matthews
Wikipedia

Cosimo de Medici
Pedes

Posts : 3
Join date : 2017-07-10

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Koopinator on Mon Jul 10, 2017 1:28 pm

Are you sure that Germany did not ask Japan for a russian offensive? I read somewhere that the entire motivation behind Declaring war on the US was so that Japan would return the favour and join the war against the Soviets. Then again, I am not sure.
avatar
Koopinator
Optio

Posts : 90
Join date : 2017-07-09

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by DavidlVofGeorgia on Mon Jul 10, 2017 1:52 pm

Those are good but I'll add some more.

1. Winter Uniforms. This is easily the biggest blunder of the whole campaign and Germans who are still alive today will tell you the importance of winter uniforms.

2. Failing to grant independence to the Baltics, and Ukraine. Finland showed that former soviet states were itching to get payback. Back then there were also large minority populations in central Asia, Siberia, and the Caucuses that would have become partisans if Germany promised them independence.

3. Shifting production from the Panzer lV and Panther to the Tiger 1. The Tiger infamously had horrible mechanical problems, was expensive and time consuming to manufacture, and the crews required additional training. The Battle of Kursk might have ended differently.

4. Failing to coordinate with Japan. Japan actually skirmished with the Soviets in 1939-1940 and asked for German help but instead Germany signed a non-aggression pact. This pissed off the Japanese and so when Germany invaded the USSR the Japanese refused just to spite them.

5. Basing predictions about the Soviet Union based on the Russian Empire. In WW1 the Russian front was a sideshow and they capitulated long before France. After Germany overran France in 1940, it looked like Russia would collapse just like in 1917. They failed to take into account the unpopularity of the Tsar compared to the Cult of Personality around Stalin.
avatar
DavidlVofGeorgia
Centurion

Posts : 138
Join date : 2017-07-08
Location : Tbilisi, Georgia

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Aaronklk on Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:47 pm

The only way I see them winning the war in the east is if Hitler wasn't so incompetent.
avatar
Aaronklk
Pedes

Posts : 24
Join date : 2017-07-08

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Holmskiy on Tue Jul 11, 2017 5:36 am

DavidlVofGeorgia wrote:Those are good but I'll add some more.

2. Failing to grant independence to the Baltics, and Ukraine. Finland showed that former soviet states were itching to get payback. Back then there were also large minority populations in central Asia, Siberia, and the Caucuses that would have become partisans if Germany promised them independence.


I severely dought this whole point. First of all, Stalin knew well about rebellious sentiments in the Caucuses (he was from there himself), so hundreds of thousands (or more) were deported to Central Asia. Central Asia itself was extremely loyal. Unlike the European republics, Central Asia has seen a massive development in economy and culture since Soviets came to power. Local population was treated completely equally with Europeans for the first time in 150 years. There was no reason to rebel. And Siberian minorities were just too small and too far away from the front.

Furthermore, Nazi Germany actually did receive assistance from many minorities of the Soviet Union, despite not giving occupied countries independence. Just the Latvian volunteer legion had over 100000 soldiers. The number of soldiers of all of these legions combined was much higher.



avatar
Holmskiy
Pedes

Posts : 21
Join date : 2017-07-09

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Cosimo de Medici on Tue Jul 11, 2017 12:23 pm

Thanks, I didn't know Germany requested a Japenese offensive

Cosimo de Medici
Pedes

Posts : 3
Join date : 2017-07-10

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Samsid on Tue Jul 11, 2017 1:13 pm

Refusing withdrawals.
avatar
Samsid
Cornicen

Posts : 41
Join date : 2017-07-09
Location : UmeƄ, Sweden

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Cold War Communist on Tue Jul 11, 2017 8:47 pm

The entire Eastern Front was a blunder. The Germans never should have opened a second front while at war with the UK.
avatar
Cold War Communist
Centurion

Posts : 263
Join date : 2017-07-11
Age : 95
Location : The East

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Octagon History on Thu Jul 13, 2017 3:57 pm

The main goal of Operation Barbarossa was to capture the Causacus Oil Fields. They instead decided to attack Leningrad,Moscow,and StalinGrad all at once and failed to make peace with the oppressed races that were in Northern Ukraine. It's almost stupid how bad it was. Also why didn't the Japanese invade Manchuria?
avatar
Octagon History
Cornicen

Posts : 33
Join date : 2017-07-08
Age : 27
Location : Lubbock,Texas

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Cold War Communist on Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:20 pm

Octagon History wrote: It's almost stupid how bad it was. Also why didn't the Japanese invade Manchuria?

The Japanese did invade Manchuria. They conquered it and set up a puppet state called Manchukuo. They also fought the Soviet Union at the Battle of Khalkhin Gol, but the Soviets defeated them. The conflict turned out so badly that the Japanese signed their own non-aggression pact with the Soviet Union to prevent any further losses.
avatar
Cold War Communist
Centurion

Posts : 263
Join date : 2017-07-11
Age : 95
Location : The East

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by That_one_Praetor on Tue Jul 18, 2017 12:47 am

Another huge blunder was when the central army group swung south to help take the Ukraine when they could have easily pushed onto a weak Moscow that wasn't in winter.
avatar
That_one_Praetor
Pedes

Posts : 8
Join date : 2017-07-18

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Adolf Francolini on Thu Jul 20, 2017 6:45 pm

Cold War Communist wrote:The entire Eastern Front was a blunder. The Germans never should have opened a second front while at war with the UK.

From what I'm aware, the Russians were poised to strike only a month or two after the Germans did. It was a preemptive necessity. IMO, if Yugoslavia and Greece were handled better, and Barbarossa began earlier, it is possible that Germany would take Moscow and essentially claim victory in 1941.
avatar
Adolf Francolini
Cornicen

Posts : 44
Join date : 2017-07-08

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by DavidlVofGeorgia on Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:23 pm

Deciding to bail out Italy was huge mistake. Tito drew as many Germans away from the Eastern front as all the Western Allies. I would have let Italy lose and only help them when the allies landed on the Italian peninsula to ensure a brutal stalemate.
avatar
DavidlVofGeorgia
Centurion

Posts : 138
Join date : 2017-07-08
Location : Tbilisi, Georgia

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Thorfinn Karlsefni on Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:41 am

Withdrawing from the heavily fortified Rzhev-Vyzma salient. In March of 1943 the Germans withdrew in order to form up a reserve that could be used at Kursk that summer. By that time, a year of human wave assault style counter-offensives by the Red Army had proven the lessons of World War 1. Unfortunately for the Germans, they were still thinking offensively, which was silly in the wake of Stalingrad and the American led offensive in North Africa. They should have recognized that static defenses were working, and could have been expanded up and down the whole front. This would have stymied the Soviet attempts to liberate their lost territory, and delayed the arrival of the Red Army in Berlin by years. Only the D-Day invassion would have forced Germany to transfer significant forces west and give the Soviets the breathing space Stalin had repeatedly ordered the Red Army to create outside Moscow.
avatar
Thorfinn Karlsefni
Centurion

Posts : 104
Join date : 2017-09-21

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Germany's WW2 Eastern Front Blunders

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum